Hodo wrote:Some of you have the wrong idea about some of these weapons, like the Boar Spear... it was WAY more than a tool. It was a weapon, many of the Normans, and Saxons used it in war because of the strength of the blade and its tongs to prevent a boar from running up the haft. While it was nearly useless against a man in full plate, it was however VERY useful against chainmail and light armored combatants like archers.
And the warpick wasnt just used to pull riders off of horses. It was HIGHLY effective at punching through plate. This is why most of the pole weapons of the later middle ages had a "bill" end. Just look at the poleaxe, halberd, and bec de corbin (spelling).
It is extremely difficult to pull a man out of an "English" saddle, which is what we have in this game. They have a high back and no horn, which makes them extremely steady seats that are hard to push off or pull off of. This is why they were designed that way... for the mounted charge, to keep the rider in the saddle when his lance makes impact.
The sword was equally ineffective against a man in full plate as a spear... but the mace, axe, and "warpick" was highly effective. It was about mass not about edge in defeating plate weapons.
Zohann wrote:Hodo wrote:Some of you have the wrong idea about some of these weapons, like the Boar Spear... it was WAY more than a tool. It was a weapon, many of the Normans, and Saxons used it in war because of the strength of the blade and its tongs to prevent a boar from running up the haft. While it was nearly useless against a man in full plate, it was however VERY useful against chainmail and light armored combatants like archers.
And the warpick wasnt just used to pull riders off of horses. It was HIGHLY effective at punching through plate. This is why most of the pole weapons of the later middle ages had a "bill" end. Just look at the poleaxe, halberd, and bec de corbin (spelling).
It is extremely difficult to pull a man out of an "English" saddle, which is what we have in this game. They have a high back and no horn, which makes them extremely steady seats that are hard to push off or pull off of. This is why they were designed that way... for the mounted charge, to keep the rider in the saddle when his lance makes impact.
The sword was equally ineffective against a man in full plate as a spear... but the mace, axe, and "warpick" was highly effective. It was about mass not about edge in defeating plate weapons.
OK. Lets not continue our nerdish internet wikipedia history discussions). Its totally my fault to start it and I am sorry about it). Let us focus on the balancing. We have 30-50 damage from boar spear to the half-plate. Even if you have a shield and use boar spear 1h, though a thrust with 2h should be twice as powerful as 1h! And still it is unclear why its not parryable or blockable. Whats the point in it? Make at least that this blockbreaking is not 100%, but at least 30%.
Even if we forget about realism at all, than all the weapons should be balanced in the point of their potential and cost. The boar spear due to its extremely low cost should not have potential equal to more expensive swords. Yet right now it is effective against any kind of armor, and any kind of enemy, be he slow or fast, since it does piercing damage, and all types of armor have relatively low piercing defense, only tier 3 scale can be somthing. Same kind in point of easiness to use Messer is not effective against plate only, and is more expensive.
We had already this issue with Partisans, and they were nerfed. Why does not it correspond to the boar spear?
Just to sum it up:
The boar spear is easy to craft and cheap.
It deals the same amount of damage as highest dps weapons.
It is long as 2h weapons.
It is fast and you can spam it, never letting your opponent to get to you.
It is unparryble.
In combination with the shield, if the opponent somehow managed to get to you, you can either passive or active block his attack, and than counter strike with your unparryble spear.
Having no shield and being on agi build, you can just parry the enemy strike and make a fast counter hit with massive damage and run behind his back, than again catch him on parry, counter strike,..,...,.. the enemy is dead.
The sequence begins until your opponent either runs away or dies, dealing you nearly no damage.
Totally balanced. As usual.
Toren wrote:Zohann wrote:Hodo wrote:Some of you have the wrong idea about some of these weapons, like the Boar Spear... it was WAY more than a tool. It was a weapon, many of the Normans, and Saxons used it in war because of the strength of the blade and its tongs to prevent a boar from running up the haft. While it was nearly useless against a man in full plate, it was however VERY useful against chainmail and light armored combatants like archers.
And the warpick wasnt just used to pull riders off of horses. It was HIGHLY effective at punching through plate. This is why most of the pole weapons of the later middle ages had a "bill" end. Just look at the poleaxe, halberd, and bec de corbin (spelling).
It is extremely difficult to pull a man out of an "English" saddle, which is what we have in this game. They have a high back and no horn, which makes them extremely steady seats that are hard to push off or pull off of. This is why they were designed that way... for the mounted charge, to keep the rider in the saddle when his lance makes impact.
The sword was equally ineffective against a man in full plate as a spear... but the mace, axe, and "warpick" was highly effective. It was about mass not about edge in defeating plate weapons.
OK. Lets not continue our nerdish internet wikipedia history discussions). Its totally my fault to start it and I am sorry about it). Let us focus on the balancing. We have 30-50 damage from boar spear to the half-plate. Even if you have a shield and use boar spear 1h, though a thrust with 2h should be twice as powerful as 1h! And still it is unclear why its not parryable or blockable. Whats the point in it? Make at least that this blockbreaking is not 100%, but at least 30%.
Even if we forget about realism at all, than all the weapons should be balanced in the point of their potential and cost. The boar spear due to its extremely low cost should not have potential equal to more expensive swords. Yet right now it is effective against any kind of armor, and any kind of enemy, be he slow or fast, since it does piercing damage, and all types of armor have relatively low piercing defense, only tier 3 scale can be somthing. Same kind in point of easiness to use Messer is not effective against plate only, and is more expensive.
We had already this issue with Partisans, and they were nerfed. Why does not it correspond to the boar spear?
Just to sum it up:
The boar spear is easy to craft and cheap.
It deals the same amount of damage as highest dps weapons.
It is long as 2h weapons.
It is fast and you can spam it, never letting your opponent to get to you.
It is unparryble.
In combination with the shield, if the opponent somehow managed to get to you, you can either passive or active block his attack, and than counter strike with your unparryble spear.
Having no shield and being on agi build, you can just parry the enemy strike and make a fast counter hit with massive damage and run behind his back, than again catch him on parry, counter strike,..,...,.. the enemy is dead.
The sequence begins until your opponent either runs away or dies, dealing you nearly no damage.
Totally balanced. As usual.
You can't really argue that the messer is balanced and complain about the spear. Messer is 3 times faster than the spears, as long as two handers, has a very small handle hitbox, and still wounds enough through armor to be very effective against half plate, and just as heavy as the boar spear. Its basically unparryable due to its speed, as well as putting out way more DPS.