Life is Feudal Official Forum

[Ishamael]

So there have been multiple posts about a North American MMO server for LIF. I fully support an NA server, but I know a lot of people are wondering how it's going to work.

I've heard people say there will not be a wipe between Wave 2 and release.

Will the NA server be started for Wave 2? Will the NA server start brand new at release? There are a lot of questions related to this, so I hope the devs can add some clarity to this system.

[Sharana]

Still open question. Bobik's last words were NA server will open with or during wave 2. The "during" part says quite clearly there are no final plans on their side. Esp with the current state of the game where wave 2 is still far ahead.

[Elindor]

I asked recently if the NA server would be up when Beta Wave 2 started (soft launch) and he said that yes it would be.

There will be a wipe between Beta Wave 1 (what we are in now) and Beta Wave 2.

Seems that Beta Wave 2 most likely won't start until around July/August.

[JackStark]

Sounds like there is a good chance for this. It would be nice for an official statement on wave 2 NA servers from a DEV though.

Many groups have both NA and European members. So players need to know how to best recruit and focus their energy. This will create a better player base for both NA and Europe servers.

[Artoria Pendragon]

i thought a single world server is better.

[JackStark]

In theory one world is better, especially with an unknown player base. Honestly though the ping for most people in NA ranges from 250-400... on bad days some of us get 900 in certain servers.

This makes pvp near impossible, with most encounters looking more akin to a 1912 short film about the dangers of running with scissors. I’d really like to have a server that NA players can get the full MMO experience on.

[Dragmar]

In theory one world is better, especially with an unknown player base. Honestly though the ping for most people in NA ranges from 250-400... on bad days some of us get 900 in certain servers.

This makes pvp near impossible, with most encounters looking more akin to a 1912 short film about the dangers of running with scissors. I’d really like to have a server that NA players can get the full MMO experience on.

Well, atm the ping is just as bad for us EU players, so I would say it has more to do with server stability atm then actual hosting. Hoping this will drasticly improve for the next couple of wave 1 phases.

[Elindor]

Sounds like there is a good chance for this. It would be nice for an official statement on wave 2 NA servers from a DEV though.

LINK
na-server-plans-t22623/

.

[JackStark]

Thanks for the link, i'm a little confused on the wordage "Yup. Server regions are planned for wave #2."

regional to me means like half the servers will be NA based and the other will be EU on one giant mmo world.

so is it one world with regional servers, or two worlds?!?!

[Freshmango55]

Thanks for the link, i'm a little confused on the wordage "Yup. Server regions are planned for wave #2."

regional to me means like half the servers will be NA based and the other will be EU on one giant mmo world.

so is it one world with regional servers, or two worlds?!?!

That's not what regional servers mean at all, nearly every single development company uses the word region to specify when they are speaking of a demographic of customers. NA is a Region, EU is a region, Oceanic is a region. Dividing the servers into two regions on one map in one massive MMO world half NA half EU servers would be a complete logistical nightmare, I can guarantee you that this will not happen.

So they have two choices, split the already very small playerbase in half and have 2 region servers clusters, on 2 different maps, or keep everyone on the already existing servers.

[Ishamael]

So they have two choices, split the already very small playerbase in half and have 2 region servers clusters, on 2 different maps, or keep everyone on the already existing servers.

This is simply incorrect.

If bitbox wants NA players to play their game for release, they will need to host an NA server. In a world where the majority of players are used to 50ms to 90ms ping, a high ping server around 250-500+ms is just not going to work. People will try it then quit saying it's laggy.

I think bitbox is working to provide regional servers because they recognize this fact.

There are thousands of NA players looking at this game... the "silent majority" that are just waiting. If bitbox delivers on their original idea then there will be a large NA playerbase.

I understand why guilds atm are worried about how the NA / EU split is going to effect them, but they have to remember they are a small minority compared to the number of people sitting on the sidelines. The people playing right now are the small minority that are sticking around through the hard times.

[Elindor]

Ishamael is right...

There are a LOT of people waiting in the wings that did not commit to this Beta Wave 1 because of the price to play time ratio (seems they might the right choice, right? )

Here are Steam stats on LIF YO
https://steamspy.com/app/290080

Here are the key stats:
Owners: 390,381 ± 17,455
Players in the last 2 weeks: 16,555 ± 3,596 (4.24%)
Players total: 352,978 ± 16,599 (90.42%)
Peak concurrent players yesterday: 1,771

So, yeah...when LIF MMO is open to YO owners (Beta Wave #2) and the general public through Steam numbers will increase pretty significantly.

I think there will probably be enough population to support an NA and EU server separately - but they have to get some major bugs and issues worked out to retain those players.

[Dragmar]

I don't doubt that the intial rush will support both a NA and a EU server. The problem I see is with longevety. This is a MMO after all, so if the population drops after the first 2 months, then what? They merge the servers? We all know that gamers these days don't "comit" to a single game like some of us did in the past. So how do they justify a large map with hardly any players after the first couple of months of hype?

But again, anything we all say now is pure speculation.

[Ishamael]

But again, anything we all say now is pure speculation.

Not really. There is data that supports anticipating a large playerbase. If there were only 10,000 purchases and 100 people on a day we would be having a different conversation.

[Dragmar]

But again, anything we all say now is pure speculation.

Not really. There is data that supports anticipating a large playerbase. If there were only 10,000 purchases and 100 people on a day we would be having a different conversation.

Well, you can have all the data you want. But until you actually get in there you really don't know.

Like I know there's a lot of M&B players that want to play this as a "larger scale MMO version of M&B" but most of them will prob be very put off as soon as they get in and realise how long it takes to get stuff done in this game.


But I would def hope this game could support several regions, nothing is more annoying to gamers then feeling like they have a disadvantage due to ping.

[Paulchatterton]

Will NA servers be accessible to EU players and vice versa? Through YO and MMO Beta, I have played with players outside of my region and would like the option to continue to play with them, if practical. In addition, I suspect that EU server will be home to some of the post aggressive PvP guilds and, even though I am located in Europe, I am inclined to choose the NA servers if the ping times are reasonable.

[Sharana]

Ofc it will, but different characters of course. No one can lock you with IP which will be stupid ))

And the fear of many americans is exactly that almost all big PvP guilds will stay on the EU server and NA will be RP party.

[Ishamael]

NA will be RP party.

Not around where I settle

[Toren]

Ofc it will, but different characters of course. No one can lock you with IP which will be stupid ))

And the fear of many americans is exactly that almost all big PvP guilds will stay on the EU server and NA will be RP party.

Now that's untrue. The fear of most Americans is that if they have to play on EU servers they will have to deal with low pop at NA primetime, have field battles and sieges during most Americans working/school hours, terrible ping which makes PvP skill completely irrelevant, and server maintenance during NA evenings as well. Well actually the main fear of most Americans I've met is that the game won't come out and PvP won't be finished properly, which is what most of them want, not large scale RP.

And if 120 people between the two largest EU alliances counts as a large amount of people then the EU server is gonna have population problems as well. Like Ishamael said, theres a lot of people waiting for this game and staying silent. If I had a nickel for every person who said they'd come back to the game when combat was "smoother", I'd have enough money to buy a Zealous Supporter Pack.

[Rickjames]

hell i could accept if half the map was EU and half was NA or some new"undisclosed but connected" area was the new NA area and you had to sail from the EU to get there.. i dont want to not have contact with EU players but i dont want to play on a EU ping unless they can get it fixed like they do in Warthunder where i crush EU players like little grapes ( except the high llying ones) damn climbers

[Lord_Sitruc]

Ofc it will, but different characters of course. No one can lock you with IP which will be stupid ))

And the fear of many americans is exactly that almost all big PvP guilds will stay on the EU server and NA will be RP party.

Now that's untrue. The fear of most Americans is that if they have to play on EU servers they will have to deal with low pop at NA primetime, have field battles and sieges during most Americans working/school hours, terrible ping which makes PvP skill completely irrelevant, and server maintenance during NA evenings as well. Well actually the main fear of most Americans I've met is that the game won't come out and PvP won't be finished properly, which is what most of them want, not large scale RP.

And if 120 people between the two largest EU alliances counts as a large amount of people then the EU server is gonna have population problems as well. Like Ishamael said, theres a lot of people waiting for this game and staying silent. If I had a nickel for every person who said they'd come back to the game when combat was "smoother", I'd have enough money to buy a Zealous Supporter Pack.

Completely agree with this.

People keep saying they are worried about US server pops but what I am worried about is losing out on participating in field battles, and sieges because I am working during prime time.

My personal opinion is a lot of the US players that go to the EU servers will become bored of missing out on all the prime time events, or frustrated when their stuff burns during EU prime time and they were only able to muster a fraction of their strength to defend their stuff.

I would rather play on a server with 1000 people and be involved in all the shenanigans then play on a server with 10000 people and be regulated to a laborer for a EU guild that goes out and fights while I am at work.

[Brother]

I just wish we had a solid timeline to work with. I'll echo the fact that there's a lot of mixing between EU and NA within guilds and knowing when the split will happen will be key to planning moving forward.

What I'm most confused by is Bobik's answer in the FAQ that the split will happen "before or during Wave 2."

I just hope we know when it will happen so we can decide when and where to invest our time. Personally, I doubt I'll invest a bunch of time on the EU server cluster during Wave 2 if they're going to open an NA server sometime during that run. Doesn't seem to make sense to me..

I'll also add that I agree with Sharana. The premier PvP will be EU. The best pvp guilds that I've spoken with all plan to go EU. Being the "best" PvPer on the NA servers will be like being the best AAA/summer/sunday league ball player.

[Toren]

I'll also add that I agree with Sharana. The premier PvP will be EU. The best pvp guilds that I've spoken with all plan to go EU. Being the "best" PvPer on the NA servers will be like being the best AAA/summer/sunday league ball player.

I too have talked to a lot of good NA groups that are planning on going to the EU server because they think it'll be a better PvP ground. The ironic thing is a lot of these NA groups are enemies, and plan on going to the EU server just to fight each other, even through they won't be able to make the field battles and sieges because they have to work/go to school during the early morning hours when they take place. I think when they realize that they won't be able to even fight the real battles on the EU server they'll regret their decision.

And a lot of the best PvPers I've met have been from NA/SA. About 80% of them at least. Of course, as someone who has played primarily on NA servers, my view of the playerbase might be pretty skewed, but I've also fought a lot of EU players. Now my idea of a great PvPer might be pretty wrong since I'm no where close to being great, but its pretty obvious when someone knows what they're doing. While the NA servers have mass groups of RPers who don't know how to PvP, a lot of the hardcore EU PvP groups have a lot of PvPers who think they know how to fight just because they can shoot a bow from a wall at a group of 10 people, or a few patches ago thought that getting an 80 speed bonus from flicking a weapon up and down made them skilled. So I'd argue that being the best NA or EU PvP group/fighter would be on pretty equal terms if they fought each other, all things considered. Not every RPer is a terrible fighter, and not every hardcore PvPer that fails to accept that the game isn't balanced and polished yet PvP wise is a great fighter.

[Sharana]

I too have talked to a lot of good NA groups that are planning on going to the EU server because they think it'll be a better PvP ground. The ironic thing is a lot of these NA groups are enemies, and plan on going to the EU server just to fight each other, even through they won't be able to make the field battles and sieges because they have to work/go to school during the early morning hours when they take place. I think when they realize that they won't be able to even fight the real battles on the EU server they'll regret their decision.

I completely agree on that, the biggest battles will keep happening on the weekend as now where NA players can take part, but that's not all. And if there was EU server opening up (NA for wave 1) I would have moved only for that reason. But that's me personally.

On the topic about PvP guilds ... well as someone who played on EU servers mainly should I say my opinion? Doesn't make much sense.
The only impression one could get was from the big (=always populated) PvP servers. Other than that we have the MMO wave 1. I didn't play YO (=meeting new guilds) in the last like 6 months. Before that while my guild was on a break from YO I played together with russians on russian servers (it's good to speak 4 languages ) as mercenary lancer (gear for fighting on their side) back in the times when lancers weren't spreaded and there were like 6 in all 3 russian guilds combined. So I played with and against EU/RU guilds mainly. But it's not really changing the current MMO picture - is it?

What good american guilds can you name? For me only Blood Vikings and Vinterscorn come to mind - one of them in BP (with mostly EU guilds and players) and the other one in KoV which is again mix of EU+NA players, just won't speculate on the ratio as I can't really know unless someone from them says. But I do know that they have hard time against big german (so EU) group. Other than that mentioned stand all the action in MMO scale (large) is between BP and USH (the russian speaking alliance).

For top individual fighters, that's like 2-3 warriors in 30+ members guilds, they are hard to find and I'm sure playing on EU it's hard to spot such NA players and vice versa, because ping is a problem and everyone looks for servers with good ping. As side note that's completely irrelevant outside of YO, in the MMO scale few great warriors that can solo kill 4-5 avarage ones mean nothing if they can easily get stomped in the field by cav or archers. The avarage level and teamwork is way more important. Every big BP or USH battle commander who already gathered experience in the MMO will tell you that when increasing the scale of the battle the importance of your top PvP core decreases exponentially. What actually decides the outcome is combination of numbers, teamwork, strategy, commander competence, avarage level of troops and luck of course (timing). Your best PvP players are somewhere at the end of such list with factors. And numbers do matter a lot - if 1 can easily win vs 3 it's much harder for 5 to win vs 15 and almost impossible for 50 to win vs 150. Skill won't decide anything in the last case unless it's 150 PvEers which is not representative example.

[Nomeatloaf]

As one of the few who have commanded large scale combat on the MMO, what sharana said is on point. skill is only about 10% of what matters for MMO scale battles. its numbers, and tactics and some other things. also, yea, please name me a few good NA pvp guilds. i have played a TON of YO, and on many different servers (NA servers), and the only other guild that was remotely good at pvp was Ironhearts, and as far as i know, they disbanded some time ago. and even then, they had very skilled 1v1ers, but put them in a larger scale battle, and they were a joke.

[Toren]

Well thats the issue. I'm not going to sit here and list 20+ good NA PvP guilds cause I don't wanna miss any. However, a lot of those guilds are waiting on the game to either get better PvP wise or at the very least, be released. So yea, for a lot of those old NA PvP guilds you can say they have a few good members but lack numbers because most of their members are just waiting for the game to drop.

I remember a time when I used to fight in group fights against Blood Vikings, Vinterskorn, and I think even Ironheart once on my groups training server, along with many other guilds that I'm not going to name but still have some active members here on the forums. Hell, even a few more guilds of the Blood Pact have fought with us on the server. But a lot of people in my group and other groups got bored of the games unfinished, unbalanced PvP especially with the speed bonus glitches back in the day. Those people still check in and ask if the PvP is finished yet, which the answer to is "its better, but not done yet". If and when this game is ever finished PvP wise, a lot of these people may come back, but the longer it takes the less likely that will happen.

Oh, and having watched all the videos of that big battle in the MMO, it looked fun but didn't really have any elements of a real "group" fight. More like a bunch of disjointed, small scale fights over a large area. Which is, again, just a product of the games poorly thought out design.

Damned Americans and their justified impatience, right?

[Sharana]

Oh, and having watched all the videos of that big battle in the MMO, it looked fun but didn't really have any elements of a real "group" fight. More like a bunch of disjointed, small scale fights over a large area. Which is, again, just a product of the games poorly thought out design.

I would say going head on with a tightly packed huge group will look fun, but will be exactly the definition of disorganized in my book. The large battles are long (this one was 4 hours if you count from the first rally point, 3 from the moment the main force entered enemy territory till porting back home.) and generally composed of many small scale skirmishes before the final battle. In this particular case it was skirmishing and tactical playing - scout parties, patrols, siege camp with healers, commander and guards, "outposts" who were guarding the possible "breach" locations - the enemy couldn't cross where his operations plan suggested (so we guessed right after hearing their words and interviews about the battle). Also killed some of their scout groups during skirmishing with our own forward troops. After all those skirmishes we ended up in pretty good advantage of 70-75 ( pretty much 0 casualties during the skirmishes who were just healed in the camp and ready for the final big battle instead of respawning on the other part of the map without the chance to rejoin) against thinned out enemy who is improvising (they had no backup plan how to get up there). As result when the final battle started it was very good for us - a moment where the enemy is splitted in defenders (12) and reinforcements (30 after the skirmishes) against something like 70, but because of the terrain and time (night comming soon, so we couldn't wait another hour for them to make their way up, had to jump down ourself) only the mounted ones (45 to 55) took part in the battle. But even in such situation (45-55 vs about 40) we had the initiative the whole time, cleared their cav from the field before dismounting and making a final push for their on foot part. And we've won with like 10-12 casualties combined, while they all died and the defenders respawned and fighted 2 times.

Going heads on 75 vs 50 in 1 big "team battle" would have resulted in much higher casulties even if it was still a win, you can't convince me that's more "organised" then what happened. It's just not really clear what's happening on the big picture through the eyes of a regular soldier (video from someone's POV), you need to be involved in the commanding and planning structure to get the whole picture

But for organisation and "disjointed team" let's just agree on organised chaos. All of this comes with experience. You start with complete chaos, go through semi-organised chaos and then into organised chaos. Lowering the chaos part are steps to be taken by everyone, it's just few groups pioneering it atm. Even the ones leading 5-10 players in YO know it's not easy, now add 70+ speaking 5 different languages. All the organisation will come with practice and that was the 1st so large fight with many other smaller scale ones (involving 60-70 players). That's why I don't believe in groups who think they will be factors but don't play wave 1. Right now it's groups with absolutely no practical clue how to coordinate and plan big and groups who are just scratching the surface and will be on completely different level compared to everyone else when wave 2 starts. Then we can really talk about organisation and large scale

Hell, even a few more guilds of the Blood Pact have fought with us on the server.

I'm sorry, but the time is not static. The Blood Pact that I joined (april 2016) is very different from the BP during wave 0 (july 2016) after 2 months of "sparing" with the russians. Even more different when wave 1 (back in December) started and completely different now after working hard during the 2 months downtime on the lessons learned during the Decembers testrun where we were ... well let's say catching up, not pioneering. And I don't speak about members or anything - I mean organisation, tactics, battle commanders expertise, average level and fighting style.
The russians I fighted against in may-june 2016 are not same ones I played with/against few months later on russian YO servers and definetly not the same ones on wave 1. And I'm speaking about the same 3 guilds with pretty much the same veteran core of fighters.

For that reason "somewhen in YO server" holds no real (up to date performance) value to me personally.

[Toren]

Don't really care if it holds any value with you, I was trying to make a point about the old LiF community and where they are now. Regardless of skill level change, its still the same people.

[Sharana]

Don't really care if it holds any value with you, I was trying to make a point about the old LiF community and where they are now. Regardless of skill level change, its still the same people.

You were trying to make a point that 80% of the best PvPers are NA players. How has that nothing nothing to do with skill level change over time if they or their groups no longer play LiF?

[Toren]

Don't really care if it holds any value with you, I was trying to make a point about the old LiF community and where they are now. Regardless of skill level change, its still the same people.

You were trying to make a point that 80% of the best PvPers are NA players. How has that nothing nothing to do with skill level change over time if they or their groups no longer play LiF?

No, I meant that I don't really care if it holds any value with you, personally. And yes, the 80% is an outdated number, but again, a lot of those people gave up because this game is taking so long to finish. Also, I said my viewpoint is skewed because of the servers I usually play on.
In the end, you could also make the argument that current player skill is irrelevant to a certain point because all of the things that are bound to change with PvP according to the dev blogs and the Bobik interview. RIP drags.