Life is Feudal Official Forum

[Dannykiers]

Hey there,

I just had a chat with a couple of friends , saying what i would have also loved in the animal sense of the game . As i am excited to work with all kinds of animals and with horses etc.

Medieval Europa also had a place for falconry and owl handling. Wouldn't it be extremly cool to be a falconer and train a falcon to catch rabbits or perform scouting actions , of course with a moderate measure of inaccuracy .

And pidgeons as messengers between towns that you can train to fly a course between towns discovered and that both have pidgeon cages or something . So that you would bypass the extreme short range of local chat and not have to disclose sensitive information on global. Or have to add them to steam which kills RP.

And wardogs, or hunting dogs. Not OP as the wolves , but just a wardog that can function as a fear inflictor . or a protector of the base as a guard when you arent around .

Just a couple of ideas regarding animals in this game, i am very curious to know people and maybe the devs their ideas on it .

[Atanar]

This is not the suggestion subforum. Spam of suggestions from people who have no idea what is doable doesn't belong here.

[Dannykiers]

This is not the suggestion subforum. Spam of suggestions from people who have no idea what is doable doesn't belong here.

some one got out of bed at the wrong side, isnt a debate about an idea or a concept considered a general discussion? But if the moderaters find it obnoxious to be in the wrong sub forum , then they can move it to that one . with my apologies for posting it in the wrong sub forum.

Because i am genuinly interested in people their thoughts and would like a constructive debate on it .

And it is possible btw , i have some great ideas on how possible implementation might look like . But that isnt the point of this discussion.

[VindicteMortis]

Falcons and owls were never used for 'scouting'.

To realistically implement them they'll add as much gameplay as snare traps so would be a redundant feature.

Also messenger pigeons were not able to 'fly to another town' - that is not how they are trained. All they pigeons can do is fly back to their own specific home. They can only 'return' messages from the location they are released.

So you need to physically take the pigeon from its nest, walk somewhere, attach a message and let it go and it'll fly home.

Again reducing its usefulness considering the amount of out of game communication solutions which are instantly better and more convenient.

[Dannykiers]

then a trained pidgeon could be traded to the friendly town . So you would be able to communicate with them since it would fly back to its original home.

And i remember tales of falconeers that would train their falcons to spot large masses of humans , I.E. armies , and fly above them in circles so that the falconeer could see the falcon from a high point circling above something .

Might be interesting in a sense .

Specially dogs , when they implement a working whitelist system for claimed objects , dog AI could be also operate as such , with a whitelist of people to be passive to , and similar AI to be aggresive towards non whitelisted persons , similar as a wolf

[VindicteMortis]

If you simply traded pigeons the pigeon will just make the new place its new home and wouldn't fly back any more.

Again, fiction with falconeers isn't really enough to justify adding it as a mechanic in a pseudo-realistic medieval game.

[Haladmer]

If you simply traded pigeons the pigeon will just make the new place its new home and wouldn't fly back any more.

Again, fiction with falconeers isn't really enough to justify adding it as a mechanic in a pseudo-realistic medieval game.

It's really hard to separate fiction from fact on some topics, falcons being one of them. It wasn't uncommon for archers to shoot birds circling overhead because there was a fear that a falconer had done just that, trained them to give away positions.

It was a time where science, religion, and superstition were often interchangeable for the common person, so there were people who took a story as fact, even where we may see it as stupid/impossible/unbelievable. So, personally, I'd not be so quick to dismiss a potential feature based on "modern" understanding of reality.

[Dannykiers]

If you simply traded pigeons the pigeon will just make the new place its new home and wouldn't fly back any more.

Again, fiction with falconeers isn't really enough to justify adding it as a mechanic in a pseudo-realistic medieval game.

It's really hard to separate fiction from fact on some topics, falcons being one of them. It wasn't uncommon for archers to shoot birds circling overhead because there was a fear that a falconer had done just that, trained them to give away positions.

It was a time where science, religion, and superstition were often interchangeable for the common person, so there were people who took a story as fact, even where we may see it as stupid/impossible/unbelievable. So, personally, I'd not be so quick to dismiss a potential feature based on "modern" understanding of reality.

I think you worded it perfectly , didnt really know how to reply. But i couldnt have said it much better myself. The "hunting" sport in modern literature is a far cry of falconeers in the old Mesopitamia . I think what they want to do with animals , can be extended . Since animals played an important role in mediaval life .
All aspects, even warfare and communication

[VindicteMortis]

sure make it so that ingame falconers can spot troop movements when they're larger than 10,000

But sure can somone actually link to a credible piece that historians look at the use of birds in warfare?

Or is this all this conjecture.

[Haladmer]

sure make it so that ingame falconers can spot troop movements when they're larger than 10,000

But sure can somone actually link to a credible piece that historians look at the use of birds in warfare?

Or is this all this conjecture.

Which was my point, there are "legends" of things happening that in modern terms we know were not possible, at least logically, but that does not mean people at the time did not believe it was possible or had been done.

Dragons, hydra, harpies, gargoyles, ghosts, demons, elves and fairies are all things that were believed to exist at that time. Hell there are people who still think they exist now (or that they did exist and are now extinct or in hiding)

I'm not saying they all need to be included in this or any other game, but in a game where praying to god gets you teleported to your home/spawn point, why not have a mechanic that allows for animal handlers to be supportive in combat?

Obviously it would need to be balanced for use, but arguing that only verified accounts should be considered also means abilities like the "teleport" should be removed at the least.

[VindicteMortis]

So there is no credible historical records of this ever actually being used?


praying home is just a handwavium rename for an important MMO game mechanic that we're going to have eitherway. So its acceptable. What it isn't, is a floodgate excuse to implement every fantasy element people want adding to this game.

Adding spy-birds and fire dragons are not congruent. Its just too much high-fantasy.

[Dannykiers]

i would have to agree , there are many unrealistic elements in the game atm, not to mention floating logs etc.

So to get completly purist about things isnt fair . and i couldnt agree more with the statements made so far.

Animals were a huge part of mediaval life, all aspects of it . since they want to do so much with agricultural animals, why not expand it a bit.
Maybe falconry would be an elite form of hunting , it wouldnt be a neccesity i.e fishing isnt also needed to get food . there are other ways.

Things are not as black and white

[Haladmer]

i would have to agree , there are many unrealistic elements in the game atm, not to mention floating logs etc.

So to get completly purist about things isnt fair . and i couldnt agree more with the statements made so far.

Animals were a huge part of mediaval life, all aspects of it . since they want to do so much with agricultural animals, why not expand it a bit.
Maybe falconry would be an elite form of hunting , it wouldnt be a neccesity i.e fishing isnt also needed to get food . there are other ways.

Things are not as black and white

To be fair, lets keep engine issues (floating logs) outside of the discussion. Most of the underlying mechanics/theme of the game is fairly "realistic"/low fantasy in design and application. But there are few mechanics, the chance to change iron to gold at 100 Alchemy for example, that are just as fantasy as using trained birds as a way to gain direction based information on groups of people.

So there is no credible historical records of this ever actually being used?


praying home is just a handwavium rename for an important MMO game mechanic that we're going to have eitherway. So its acceptable. What it isn't, is a floodgate excuse to implement every fantasy element people want adding to this game.

Adding spy-birds and fire dragons are not congruent. Its just too much high-fantasy.

As I said previously, I'm not arguing they should be included. However accepting "handwavium" on a convenience factor/mechanic opens the excuse for other factors/mechanics.

As to how/what birds can be trained for, if we can (and have) trained them to defend specific aircraft from other birds (http://www.essex.ac.uk/lifts/memory_map ... lcons.html) why is it so hard to make the jump it might have happened a couple hundred years in the past, considering modern understanding is built on previous experience.

People have trained birds to override their natural instinct (in hunting, the bird does not eat the captured game) by use of simple behavior rewarding, is it really so unthinkable that they could have taught a bird to find groups of people and circle for a minute before returning?

I don't read that as being a GPS style feature (pointing arrows) with full details (X number of people wearing plate and using halbards) that seem to be what Gentry is implying it would be.

As long as the falconer had to remain within visible range (or a system defined X meters/yards), the bird was a "pet" type of resource that required training, and thus specific skills to use, could be killed, and there was a limited time it would circle, it just doesn't seem to be that big of an issue to believe it could be done.

Honestly, I'd prefer for this as way to know a group of players were in the area over the "handwavium" convenience mechanic of teleporting, at least this could be countered by a sharp-eyed archer.