Life is Feudal Official Forum

[Ulfheoinn]

Did you read what I wrote ?


I argumented the "so easy to get in castle" part.

If you're not able to just grab a sling or a crossbow/bow to shoot those guys or just waiting them with a weapons to prevent them to come in the way they try, well, you have nothing to do on this game.

"and then log back in there to kill unprepared people inside. "

Yeah, did you atleast play the MMO ?

You can't log back in the claim of an enemy.
When you log in enemy claims, the game put you just at the limit of this one.
So, not a valable argument.

"Pls dont kill this Game by making it an Empty and Dead PvP Arena. The niche of players is so incredible small that it hardly supports one such game. And we already got 10 or so on the Market...."

Sound like you want to play only 50% of this game.
Because yeah, this game is 50% about craft/sandbox and 50% about PvP. Deal with it.

If you're not able to, stop whinning, and seriously go to Sims Medieval, or Minecraft, there is a tons medieval sandbox, compared to games like Life is Feudal, we don't need peoples like you. You're just ruining the game with all the whinning "I get killed, I didn't wanted to " "I have walls i'm supposed to be invincible

[sunleader]

Did you read what I wrote ?


I argumented the "so easy to get in castle" part.

If you're not able to just grab a sling or a crossbow/bow to shoot those guys or just waiting them with a weapons to prevent them to come in the way they try, well, you have nothing to do on this game.

"and then log back in there to kill unprepared people inside. "

Yeah, did you atleast play the MMO ?

You can't log back in the claim of an enemy.
When you log in enemy claims, the game put you just at the limit of this one.
So, not a valable argument.

"Pls dont kill this Game by making it an Empty and Dead PvP Arena. The niche of players is so incredible small that it hardly supports one such game. And we already got 10 or so on the Market...."

Sound like you want to play only 50% of this game.
Because yeah, this game is 50% about craft/sandbox and 50% about PvP. Deal with it.

If you're not able to, stop whinning, and seriously go to Sims Medieval, or Minecraft, there is a tons medieval sandbox, compared to games like Life is Feudal, we don't need peoples like you. You're just ruining the game with all the whinning "I get killed, I didn't wanted to " "I have walls i'm supposed to be invincible

Now your Just Trolling and very Obviously not Reading.

1.
We are Talking about Sneaking over the Walls when nobody is Online.
So your rubbish about Crossbowing him is bullshit because you cant Crossbow anyone when your not Online.
2.
Did not know that. Not sure it works that way either.
I logged out and back in on a smaller Guilds Claim last time.
At least I got the message that I was inside that Guilds Claim right away when I logged in. They had no Walls tough. Albeit I doubt the Game recognizes that.
3.
Thats my Signature not part of the Post lol.
And yes I want 60% Sandbox and 40% PvP (Its boring if theres no Fighting)
Unfortunately what you guys are Arguing for is a clear 99% PvP and 1% Sandbox because you basicly want that PvP Tops Sandbox in all areas.

If Building is not providing any Protection than for what would anyone Builds Walls at all ?
Walls are supposed to keep people from entering.
Thats what 50/50 would be.

You can still Destroy the Walls when actually Attacking the Castle.
But being able to abuse a Bug of Floating Items to get over the Walls without actually attacking is Bullshit.
The only ones who need that Mechanic are Griefers who want to Enter such Walls outside of the Battles to Grief People.


There is a Reason why Attacks are Planned to take place as Instanced Battles at an preset Time Frame.
Its made so both sides actually have People there for that Battle.
Its made exactly to prevent this Bullshit of Offhour Attacks where one side overcomes the Walls and Defensive Structures before the Defender is Online and then awaits them inside their own Castle to Kill them.

And this Bug abuse is preventing that.



This Bug is not useful for PvP.
The only thing its useful for is Griefing.

[Grimmblut]

As someone who has climbed over ... a few ... walls in LIF:YO and the MMO I can tell you that there are ways to lower the chance to be teleported out of a claim after you relog to maybe 5-10%. We have reported it to the Devs and I guess that it is in their bug tracker.

You can't prevent people from getting into your town, walls or not. It's only a matter of how high you set the bar for the intruders (active counter-measures like shooting help, of course, if you got the chance to do that).

Carry armor and a Gross Messer all the time and learn how to use it. That's the best you can do regarding fighting in towns.

[sunleader]

As someone who has climbed over ... a few ... walls in LIF:YO and the MMO I can tell you that there are ways to lower the chance to be teleported out of a claim after you relog to maybe 5-10%. We have reported it to the Devs and I guess that it is in their bug tracker.

You can't prevent people from getting into your town, walls or not. It's only a matter of how high you set the bar for the intruders (active counter-measures like shooting help, of course, if you got the chance to do that).

Carry armor and a Gross Messer all the time and learn how to use it. That's the best you can do regarding fighting in towns.

Aye and thats the thing.
Right now that bar is so low its non existent.

Walls should take quite the effort to get over.


This is a Game. So we have no permanent Guardposts that are there 24 hours a day. Nor do we have actual populations.
Worse. As you lose everything when you die you spawn naked.

So with this instead of actual Battles. We will have offhour attacks to kill enemies from their own houses.


I can tell you what I would do.
In the Night before an Battle I would send a Combat Group into the Enemy Castle so they kill everyone who logs in there or Respawns. Making sure that when the actual Battle Starts the enemy sits there naked as I build up a trebuchet on their central plaza to destroy their houses....



Thats why Walls should be something that can not be overcome easily outside an actual assault.

Otherwise we wont have real battles in this game.
We will have griefing contests where the winner of the Wars will be the Guild which manages to sneak onto the enemy city in the offhours and kill them when they login after which they block their respawn and equipment stores thus making it impossible to fight.

[Azzerhoden]

<diarrhea diatribe>

You-all is missing the point of this troll. Jester wants to build a large fortification all by himself, and then be completely protected from anyone coming in and attacking him.

And no matter how many times you point out to him that this is not that game, he is bound an determined to flood the forums with his diarrhea diatribe (diarrhea because its lacks any substance) in the mistaken belief he will make changes to a game that has been in development for almost 10 years, right before its gets launched.

[sunleader]

Shut up Griefer.
Nobody is interested in your delusions about me.
If you need attention go poke a beehive or something.....

[Sharana]

I can tell you what I would do.
In the Night before an Battle I would send a Combat Group into the Enemy Castle so they kill everyone who logs in there or Respawns. Making sure that when the actual Battle Starts the enemy sits there naked as I build up a trebuchet on their central plaza to destroy their houses....

Man, aren't you tired of spreading bullshit and stupid theory crafting that sounds ridiculous as result of your total unfamiliarity with how the game actually works? I can understand the initial trolling, but that's over the board already, take a break because as you see no one cares about the bullshit in your head. If you think you know so much just make your own game ffs and we will come to bullshit for days...

Shedding some light on your total ignorance:
First of all - jumping over walls takes time. That time is determined by the type of all and terraforming. Building stone wall is dirty cheap and quite easy to begin with, that alone is quite easy to jump over which is working as intended. After all guilds have stone walls after 1 week of playing, even before they get decent weapons, so it's that easy to build them. Now the terraforming is what makes it much harder to jump over if you invest the time to do it properly as it requires more effort then actually building the walls. Invest in good terraforming + 2 layers of walls and it will be exponentially harder for enemies to jump inside the town itself (time consuming where the question comes is it actually worth it to jump inside).
If you invest in end game walls like the castle ones it's much more complicated as well - the castle walls are at least 3 times higher which is much much harder to jump over. We have such around the keep on the MMO, even if no one is online it will be 2 hours at the very least to jump over them and that's if no one is online. With 1-2 lancers and few archers you just won't be able to unless you come with 30+ players.
http://i.imgur.com/jxVHv8R.jpg


Now let's say the enemy is inside the town - so what? He can't destroy/loot/spawnkill (the last one unless you are not stupid enough to leave the house doors open). Let's take your ridiculous scenario - you jump inside at 3 am in the middle of the night. The official battles are only in the evening, let's say 19-20 pm. Are you going to stay online all that time?! Because if you log out then you are ending up outside the walls and will have to work your way inside again, this time under fire. And let's say you are inside all the time - the normal players have a habit to log out inside a house/keep so that when they log in they end up there where the enemy can't enter. They can assemble and go out of the house/keep and kill the enemy. Also if they get killed because of log outing in the middle of no where in their base they spawn inside a house, so they can't be spawn killed. Each decent guild has armory in the houses, so you can wait for your res. sickness, take new gear, train up some lost skill and go out to fight again when your other guildmates are ready too. Not to mention the archers who can shoot out of the balconies and there is no chance to enter and kill them in melee. So my question is - what exactly will you achieve with such attack before official instanced battle?

[Hieve]

Guys - first please be calm to each other, this should be a >bug< discussion and no flame wars about your personal behaviour.


I see here 2 fractions :

one that shares a bit of my opinion that you should be SAFE behind your walls for intruders, as long as they are not strong enough to destroy walls and
the other fraction that just thinks that these mechanics are ok to keep pvp up and running


From my own and my friends perspective this game is a huge grinder > you take long for everything you do, but as far as you have it you can be happy and proud of what you done!
now the box mechanic destroys these whole "grind" -> griefers can join our server and can get loot within small amounts of time just by climbing over castle walls, where the inhabitants might be afk or even not online, and this in case is an unfair mechanic!

[sunleader]

I can tell you what I would do.
In the Night before an Battle I would send a Combat Group into the Enemy Castle so they kill everyone who logs in there or Respawns. Making sure that when the actual Battle Starts the enemy sits there naked as I build up a trebuchet on their central plaza to destroy their houses....

Man, aren't you tired of spreading bullshit and stupid theory crafting that sounds ridiculous as result of your total unfamiliarity with how the game actually works? I can understand the initial trolling, but that's over the board already, take a break because as you see no one cares about the bullshit in your head. If you think you know so much just make your own game ffs and we will come to bullshit for days...

Shedding some light on your total ignorance:
First of all - jumping over walls takes time. That time is determined by the type of all and terraforming. Building stone wall is dirty cheap and quite easy to begin with, that alone is quite easy to jump over which is working as intended. After all guilds have stone walls after 1 week of playing, even before they get decent weapons, so it's that easy to build them. Now the terraforming is what makes it much harder to jump over if you invest the time to do it properly as it requires more effort then actually building the walls. Invest in good terraforming + 2 layers of walls and it will be exponentially harder for enemies to jump inside the town itself (time consuming where the question comes is it actually worth it to jump inside).
If you invest in end game walls like the castle ones it's much more complicated as well - the castle walls are at least 3 times higher which is much much harder to jump over. We have such around the keep on the MMO, even if no one is online it will be 2 hours at the very least to jump over them and that's if no one is online. With 1-2 lancers and few archers you just won't be able to unless you come with 30+ players.
http://i.imgur.com/jxVHv8R.jpg


Now let's say the enemy is inside the town - so what? He can't destroy/loot/spawnkill (the last one unless you are not stupid enough to leave the house doors open). Let's take your ridiculous scenario - you jump inside at 3 am in the middle of the night. The official battles are only in the evening, let's say 19-20 pm. Are you going to stay online all that time?! Because if you log out then you are ending up outside the walls and will have to work your way inside again, this time under fire. And let's say you are inside all the time - the normal players have a habit to log out inside a house/keep so that when they log in they end up there where the enemy can't enter. They can assemble and go out of the house/keep and kill the enemy. Also if they get killed because of log outing in the middle of no where in their base they spawn inside a house, so they can't be spawn killed. Each decent guild has armory in the houses, so you can wait for your res. sickness, take new gear, train up some lost skill and go out to fight again when your other guildmates are ready too. Not to mention the archers who can shoot out of the balconies and there is no chance to enter and kill them in melee. So my question is - what exactly will you achieve with such attack before official instanced battle?

Seeing the First two Parts are Totally Irrelevant.

The Last Part shows you have obviously never been in any Big Wars in such Games.

1.
You dont need to "Spawnkill"
You get 4-5 People into the City while nobody is Online.
Then you just Gank everyone inside the City.
Even with Closed Doors they will be Confined to their Houses.
So they will have the Disadvantage and unless they Store several Sets of Equipment at their House thus being able to Reequip right away. They will be useless for any Future Fights.

Moreover any Future Fights are also a Disadvantage. Because they can see your Houses. So they can stay as a Group while you need to go out of your Houses which means even if you all log in together and then come out of the Houses at once they will get some of you while still alone.

2.
Well. On the last Server War in Mortal Online we managed to get a Group into an Enemy Stronghold at around 2 o clock in the Night.
And we had People inside there all the Way to 4 o Clock in the afternoon. So for 14 Hours.
For a 1 Day Action its not a Problem for an Active Guild to Muster Forces to stay online throughout the day.
As its a One Time Action and YOU can choose when it happens. Thus not requiring to keep it running for very long.
Its not a Problem.

3.
The War System works so that during the Daily Battle Time you can actually Destroy anything thats not in Central Claim Area.
Or an Personal Claim Area.
However Personal Claim Area can apparently be removed.

So instead of Fighting you in Full Gear in a Field Battle when you got Cavalry and possibly even Mercenaries Fighting for you.
I will simply get my Guild for a Day Action Ready.
In which the more Active guys from the Guild will Log in early.
Enter your Guild Area.
Kill anyone who Logs in while running a Nice Music Bot in Teamspeak.
Sitting on your own Walls as we shoot you the moment you leave your Houses and also Shoot into your Windows if your House has them.
Building small stuff to block off stuff your boxes etc so you can reach em easily.

And by the time the Battletime of the Server Starts. We will be sitting with our Guild inside your Town. Being able to Destroy anything thats not in the Central Guild Claim Area.
And having a massive Advantage in a Fight. Cause several of you will have been Killed logging in during the Day.
Others might not be there that day as they got Real Life and did not know we will Attack.
So whatever is left of your Guild can make the combined effort all logging in at once hopefully inside their Houses and then being able to all Come out at once.
Still having a Big Disadvantage because we will be there in Formations and Shooting down at you from your own Walls while your trying to gather together from the different Houses your in




See Guys.
I dont know if your Realizing the Options this System gives people to abuse it.
And actually want to abuse them thus not liking the idea of them being Fixed.
Or if your just so Inexperienced in this Type of Game that your honestly not expecting such basic options of abuse.

But seriously.
For being such Cracks at this Game your apparently really not very creative when it comes to War Tactics for Games like this.
Unfortunately others wont be like that.

Albeit well. The War System was not yet in. And there was no several Month long Tests yet. So its likely normal that you guys did not yet have any Big Server Wars.

[Sharana]

Some long text without saying anything useful as usual

Thank you for proving yet again how faaaaaaar you are away from LiF.

The Last Part shows you have obviously never been in any Big Wars in such Games.

Had a good laugh, thanks for that

[sunleader]

Some long text without saying anything useful as usual

Thank you for proving yet again how faaaaaaar you are away from LiF.

The Last Part shows you have obviously never been in any Big Wars in such Games.

Had a good laugh, thanks for that

And yet.
You are apparently unable to provide a Single Good Argument against it.
Which is not Surprising. After all this Follows the Rules that you yourself Posted in your Explanation of the War Mechanics.

And well Sorry. But thats the Feeling I get.

Either you guys actually want this Griefing Rubbish to be the Way the Game is Played.
Or your seriously so Naive that you believe there to be actual Battles in a War with that System.
Which shows that you cant have been in any Major Wars on such Games. Because thats ultimately how Wars in these Games are Fought if the Systems do not prevent it.

[Dragmar]

Or your seriously so Naive that you believe there to be actual Battles in a War with that System.
Which shows that you cant have been in any Major Wars on such Games. Because thats ultimately how Wars in these Games are Fought if the Systems do not prevent it.

You do realise that the battles in wars in LiF will be fought in instanced off battles right?

And when you get to the siege part, if you have a clan large enough to be able to get 50 guys to hold a base for 14 hours before the siege starts, good for you but if you'd taken your time to read up on it you would know that before the siege starts any enemy on the claim would be moved out. Ofc, that might not mean much if it's right beforehand, since as you said, you would have forced them into their houses. But if you've had enough guys with enough dedication to sit there for that long, hey, you've earned that victory.

[sunleader]

No. And thats the thing. YOU DID NOT EARN this Victory.
You abused a Bug to get into a place you should not be. And kill people which you might never have beaten in a field battle.

And then the instanced battle happens and your enemy is teleported there with several naked guys and lack of equipment because you were confined to your house.


A Victory like this which was achieved by abusing weaknesses in the game mechanics is not earned its cheated.

[Dragmar]

No. And thats the thing. YOU DID NOT EARN this Victory.
You abused a Bug to get into a place you should not be. And kill people which you might never have beaten in a field battle.

Abused a bug? You do know they are adding climbing to the game? You can litteraly walk up to a wall, rightclick it and start climbing, given that you have the skill.
A legit ingame feature to scail walls, so how is that a bug?

[Azzerhoden]

No. And thats the thing. YOU DID NOT EARN this Victory.
You abused a Bug to get into a place you should not be. And kill people which you might never have beaten in a field battle.

Abused a bug? You do know they are adding climbing to the game? You can litteraly walk up to a wall, rightclick it and start climbing, given that you have the skill.
A legit ingame feature to scail walls, so how is that a bug?

Or that Trebs can throw their loads over the walls and destroy the monument without the need of sending folks over the wall or even destroying the wall.

But I'm sure that actual, real physics is some sort of bug as well. Right Jester?

[Azzerhoden]

one that shares a bit of my opinion that you should be SAFE behind your walls for intruders, as long as they are not strong enough to destroy walls and

Hieve, thank you for sharing your opinion and doing so in a respectful manner toward those who will disagree with you. I will show you the same respect, while also being somewhat blunt.

I am afraid your version of what this game should be does not match that of the original dev plan from Bitbox. On the wiki is an FAQ composed from a long running thread that I believe is now gone. Specifically I will point out the following text:

53. can you climb mountains or only jump like in minecraft

53) You'll be able to climb mountains, some trees, maybe even walls with a good climbing skill level.

207. Will there be jumping or only climbing for scaling walls/fences, etc? Will I be able to jump over a low fence?

207)You will be able to jump over small obstacles, some fences. Other fences and walls would require you to have a higher level of climbing skill.

294. Do I have to fear being killed by other players at any time even while offline?

294) No, you can not be killed while you are offline. You can not be killed in starting NPC city and in some area around it. And if you stay behind your personal or guild claim walls - you will be pretty safe too.

485. Will it be possible to extend the protected land? What if my guild wanted to build a large city? Would we just have to build massive city walls? It would be hard to build a large metropolis if you couldn't extend the protected area. The city would be easily sieged.

485) You will not be able to extend city claim protected area. Though you can always make a walls perimeter away from city claim area. But you will have to defend them from raids on a daily basis, though destroying a castle wall will not be an easy task and will need a good amount of men and siege equipment, so I doubt that occasional raids of your enemies wil lbe able to break through, unless you really not protecting that perimeter with your own forces. And yes, it was stated before, that we might introduce raiding window of opportunity, so you will not have to protect your assets on your country claim 24/7.

Source is http://lifeisfeudal.gamepedia.com/Faq.

As you can see, walls are supposed to provide some protection, but not complete protection. Hostile players are expected to be able to get over walls with some difficulty, but in general your stuff will be safe from raiders unless you are carrying it with you.

[AndrejVinterskorn]

It is regrettable that you lost your stockpiles of items and other various sundries, consider it a sign though that if the process of rebuilding the stockpile became ad nauseum instead of enjoyable moving on is probably what's best.

[sunleader]

No. And thats the thing. YOU DID NOT EARN this Victory.
You abused a Bug to get into a place you should not be. And kill people which you might never have beaten in a field battle.

Abused a bug? You do know they are adding climbing to the game? You can litteraly walk up to a wall, rightclick it and start climbing, given that you have the skill.
A legit ingame feature to scail walls, so how is that a bug?

So long Story Short.
You want this to become Griefer Wars.

Were there is no actual Battles between Guilds. But instead Wars are an Contest to See who can pester the other Guild with Offhour Attacks late at night and prevent them from playing the Game.


Because thats what it boils down to.


See Mate. If I tought this might not become an issue I would not Post here.
So yeah nice of you telling me that we might get even more Mechanics which will effectively Result in the Game turning into an Griefer Contest to see who is more ready to miss out on Sleep and run his Attacks in the late night off Hours.

However its not affecting my Statement.

[Some_Jerk]

I don't think that LiF is right for the OP of this thread, I think he made a good decision in deciding to stop playing. What I think most of us can agree on that makes this game fun is that you have to be constantly looking over your shoulder while you craft, you should never be truly safe.
Best of luck to you OP, I hope that you find the right game for you, and since you brought it up I would like to say that I think objects can still be lifted too high. It would be an improvement to limit how high up you can place them further.

[Azzerhoden]

I don't think that LiF is right for the OP of this thread, I think he made a good decision in deciding to stop playing. What I think most of us can agree on that makes this game fun is that you have to be constantly looking over your shoulder while you craft, you should never be truly safe.
Best of luck to you OP, I hope that you find the right game for you, and since you brought it up I would like to say that I think objects can still be lifted too high. It would be an improvement to limit how high up you can place them further.

[Forresthunt]

[quote] I would like to say that I think objects can still be lifted too high. It would be an improvement to limit how high up you can place them further./quote]

that would solve the problem.
On the other hand there should be some proper siege ladder that requires more than a few branches from the nearest tree to scale the walls.
the boxes and sleeping bags, right or wrong, simply mess up the game esthetics.

by the way, thank you, I enjoyed the online insults exchange. Quite entertaining. Ironically, a guy calling himself Some_Jerk, came up with constructive idea. Priceless
cheers Everyone, Life is Feudal

[Hieve]

as this theme has gone a bit under the radar....
I just discovered this on the MMO Server:





a bridge made out of beds, to be honest , especially this russian guild was and is always really creative ;P


BUT, new players may see this and think like "wtf, this is a glitchy mess game, I don't want to play on" , especially when it tooks HOURS AND HOURS AND HOURS to build stuff, which then gets destroyed by simple game exploits and stuff.


I know there was just an Update stopping people from stuffing people into others claims, when not in judgment hour, but the reality looks quite different...
Guilds bring up 5-10 people with log carrieres and get them just before the judgment hour starts onto the enemy lines.
Besides that I read that these Bark Boxes are now officialy called "Climbing Ladders" , which for me, sounds like a bad excuse for not bringing in real ladders and accepting things that gone horribly wrong?

Don't get me wrong please Guys, I am just this critical as this is a huge MMO Project and could be something wonderful. But especially such exploiting or ugly mechanics could stop new players from joining!

[Zenebatos2]

This discussion as gone both sides, and i'll only add one thing.

i'm a Builder, and i feel darn fucking useless when after i spent 8 hours a day, gaterhing materials, working them ,then building Stone walls and then castle walls for weeks, with all the ressources that as been sunked into it, to see a darn guy "climbing" over it using cheap boxes or beds that magically sticks on the side of a vertical drop wall, then simply use the /stuck command to bypass any "extra" defenses we might have put up there to be sure that they won't get over it...

Why even bother with the wall building and sink 6-8 hours a day, for something that is has usefull as a band aid on a wooden leg?...

I'll would'nt mind if they used Siege towers, ladders, or even climbing gear and stuff, that would mean that they had to sink time and ressources to overcome what you did, and would be fair game, but seeing all those beds that costs just a few branches and fibres to make all over the walls, i just don't want to even play anymore.

I understand that no obstacle should be "unpenetrable", but the balance is completly off when compared the timeXeffort ratio of both methods...