Life is Feudal Official Forum

[QuakeNaked]

On my dedi server I've been watching the forest as it migrates to the "optimal state" and I've noticed that as the original 100 quality trees die off, it seems that new 100 quality trees aren't dropping. In the past it was the forest soil that seedlings dropped on which determined the quality of the tree. With what I've read about how this algorithm works, it seems that it shouldn't matter anymore as the game will ensure a certain percentage of quality and type.

The players on my server are complaining that all the trees (especially the oaks) are really low quality, not even above 50, and they've asked if we might use the tree script to cull the low quality trees. I have assured them it's the new algorithm just trying to move towards the optimal state and it could literally take 2-3 real time months for it to work out.

The drawback to this is: People have become accustomed to being in the "end game" within 90 days, they aren't going to wait a real time month or more for trees to grow when they're building their settlements RIGHT NOW.

I think the idea of the algorithm is really great - all except for how long it takes for trees to grow, and adding undergrowth which is taking over the forest. As far as undergrowth goes, it has no purpose except to get in the way (forcing the player to chop it down in order to activate the tree next to it) and cause morning lag because the server is checking this tree algorithm to spawn trees to replace what's been culled and most of it is undergrowth. The whole point was to ease up morning lag by preventing forest overgrowth, and this new undergrowth is defeating the purpose.

I think with a few adjustments, this could actually be one of the best improvements you've made in the game. Nuke the undergrowth, optimize the algorithm so it can work in less time, and this could be golden!

[Baal]

Yes original q100 trees all finally die but there is some rare chance new q100 to grow, but even if it don't grow, it is the job of a forester to keep good tree rotation in a clan, and it have the hability to improve quality of sappling when harvesting to reach q100 from a q80 sappling, so q100 will never disappear from game until forester do the job.

For me big lags are usually caused not by the algorithm but by the amount of tree planted by players in a small amount of time so all those tree have same age and grow/die during the same tick so it cause lag by the amount of data calculation. I can remember play in new server and there is no morning lag at all, with native trees and no/low player's planted trees.
To get less lag the algorithm should set a random timing life for trees planted by players (a few ingame days difference +-1day) so finally there will be less calculation per tick. And plus that we will not see anymore entire orchard and plantation die after one day without warning.

For the undergrowth the purpose is cosmetic wich is great but also to prevent a too much dense forest to grow by occupying some tiles, so server will never became dense impassable forest like before.

[QuakeNaked]

there is some rare chance new q100 to grow, but even if it don't grow, it is the job of a forester to keep good tree rotation in a clan

That's how it's always been, however, this new algorithm has done something that I don't know if anyone really expected. Just yesterday I planted high quality apple trees, the algorithm registered new apple trees and so culled the oldest apple trees. Suddenly players are complaining the apple trees with high enough quality to produce apples all disappeared. There are no apple trees high enough quality now to produce apples, and so we have to wait a long time for the higher quality apple trees planted to get old enough to produce apples. In the winter months there will be mass die off of livestock if there's not enough apples to feed them. This is just a chain reaction of how this new algorithm isn't really working well in practical application.

Also, the devs haven't mentioned if forest soil quality is still the determining factor in the quality of trees that spawn. If so, then even qualities high enough for apple trees to produce apples will also become rare because 90% of forest soil is quality 10. If that's what the devs want, then I am once again led to believe that they have no intention whatsoever to continue LiF:YO after the MMO release, because this is clearly not designed with long term play in mind.

Having a "Forester" who's only job is to manage forest is well and good, however, people joining the server after just one or two Foresters have been at work will not be able to find higher quality trees to harvest saplings from, there just won't be any. They'll be forced to have to beg, barter, or steal from the senior players. So let's say they are able to do that, and then guess what's going to happen? They're going to plant their forest and the established Forester is going to notice their trees are dying off left and right because everyone is planting trees now, and the oldest trees will die first. With how long it takes trees to grow, being a Forester isn't going to help you in the long run because you're still not going to have enough higher quality trees that have useful lumber to work with when every game day trees are dying (note for griefer's paradise, plant 1000 trees which will kill everyone's ability to build infrastructure).

The more I think about it, the more it seems that the tree script mod was the better solution. Admins could choose the base quality and then players planting trees would be able to have their higher quality lumber in only a few days and new players joining would have mid-quality trees with enough lumber to harvest, and when they plant their own forest, it's not killing the trees anyone else planted.

Because that's just it, I plant a tree to replace the tree that died because you planted a tree, and when I plant my tree it's going to kill your tree... and then see-saw back and forth and eventually it's going to Lumber Wars 2.0.

Yes, I exaggerate because the algorithm isn't all THAT bad, but it isn't working well in practical application. I'm all ready handing out high quality apple sprouts to my players because we just got done with winter, nobody has been able to plant wheat to feed livestock, so they're relying on apples that are just not there now - and even though I just gave them sprouts to plant, it's going to take a long time for those new trees to produce apples, and so people are scrambling to get wheat in the ground and keeping fingers crossed that with the new harvest algorithm, they won't have a massive livestock die off waiting on wheat to grow now.